DC Comics is currently publishing a comic book called Justice League of America, but to me it does not star the Justice League. Why do I feel this way? Because DC and the writer keep putting in stuff to tell me this is about the Justice League when the identity of the team should be obvious.
The latest issue, 51, opens up with a collection of heroes attacking a green dome. A collection of heroes who could be – and many have been – the Justice League. Superman, Flash, Green Lantern, Red Tornado, Zatanna, Steel, Dr. Light, the Atom, Captain Atom, Firestorm, Zauriel, plus some Metal Men, JSAers, and Titans. Then Superman tells us the team inside is the JLA. Who’s left? Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Plastic Man, Hawkman, John Stewart maybe? That is the point, when you see the group, it should be obvious that they are the JLA. This is not.
Instead we get Batman (Grayson), Donna Troy, Jade, Jesse Quick and Supergirl. I think Cyborg is on the team too, but he was not in this issue. The problem is this team is not iconic enough. Wally West, Kyle Rayner, Conner Hawk, and Dick Grayson worked as members of the JLA when they were THE representation of DC icons Flash, Green Lantern, Green Arrow, and Batman. Now, no one would create a JLA not using Barry Allen, Hal Jordan, Oliver Queen and Bruce Wayne in those roles. Oh wait, they did.
The next issue is the piece of text describing why we have a Justice League. "At times of crisis, earth’s greatest heroes come together to combat evil. The roster may change, but the fight for justice continues. They are the JLoA." I cannot disagree more. First of all, for almost every major crisis in the DC universe, the JLA has been disbanded. That aside, these are hardly earth’s greatest heros. By the way, "Earth’s Mightiest Heroes" is the tag line of Marvel’s Avengers. The JLA is the "World’s Greatest Super-Heroes". It was on every cover as I was growing up. And that little "the roster may change" is just a way of saying "we decided we wanted to write about this group".
Now, sometimes a certain character is not available. I was surprised to see Superman – currently walking across the country, Captain Atom – currently chasing down Maxwell Lord, and Firestorm – currently dealing with Brightest Day issues in the opening pages. Wonder Woman is dealing with something that has changed her past. But that still leaves us with a ton of heroes who put together would make one think of the JLA instead of the Titans and Infinity Inc.
I am in no way a "The BIG 7 is the only real version of the JLA." In fact, Gardner Fox, writer of the earliest JLA stories once mentioned in an interview that he interned to use Green Arrow in the first JLA story but forgot about him when writing it. The JLA has been more that just the BIG 7 since issue 4 back in 1960. The Big guns. The current holders of the big names. A few better known characters. Yet with room for a few characters who had never been members before and a few choices by the writer.
A few issues back, #49, Donna Troy talked about how she had ‘moved up’ to the JLA. It felt like a wimpy attempt at justifying why she was in the book. At the same time, the same writer had Roy Harper’s arm ripped off. Robinson was quoted as saying, "Roy would only ever be the 2nd greatest archer." So here we have one writer saying that promoting one Titan to the JLA was wrong, but its OK for this writer to promote 1/2 a dozen heroes with the same issues, never going to be the #1 greatest at their talent.
The other problem with this group, is they already have a book. Its called Titans. Jesse Quick was a member for a while. Jade could easily be there too. Oh wait. DC screwed that up by filling up their book with a villain team that kills heroes. Yeah, that is what I would expect if I picked up a book called "Titans."
In 1996, I visited the offices of DC Comics and talked to the then editor and assistant editor of the JLA comic. When they found out I was a complete-ist, they explained how people like me skew the perception that DC is producing what we want to read. People like me kept the Detroit era JLA going longer than it should have. I will not do the same now.
Dear DC Comics, Consider the Justice League disbanded (due to the fact I am no longer buying it) until you put together a team that lets me know they are the JLA by its membership, not by trying to tell what it is. A few new characters are fine, but we need a core group that makes you instantly feel like you are reading about the Justice League. Psst, the current comic titled ‘JLA/the 99′ actually feels like it contains the JLA …
Comic cover pictures credit to: Grand Comics Database
Well, I am a big 7 kind of guy and maybe throw in Atom and Green Arrow and Black Canary. I cannot read the book as it is presently. Because I dont care about Congorilla, etc. I am not a big Grant Morrison guy~but he had it together when he revamped the JLA and made it a powerhouse. This series will get scrapped and relaunched with yet another new #1 eventually. With the main 7 being the senior staff. Just wait for it. I know I am.
Actually, I kind of like Congorilla and Starman. It is the ejection of the main JLA and replacing them with their sidekicks that bugs me.
to me the jla has always been some of the big guns like at least the trinity. a couple magic users like zartana and also at least some character who has always deserved a shot at the team but never has been used like cyborg. but odds are the current version will be around till dc decides it needs the team to have the big guns back to make it the worldest greatest again.
Well said, man. I haven’t read JLA for a while, and that bums me out. I love the ‘big 7′, but I’m all about the Satellite Era. I gave the new Justice League of America when it started after JLA fizzled, but that shot lasted about three issues. That’s my window. 3 issues. I really want to put this title back on my pull list, but every month, with every solicit, I just say ‘pass’.
Interesting. That team had a classic, big 7, satellite feel to it. Could you elaborate on what it was that made you drop the book after only 3 issues (the 1st story ran until issue 7)?
I hate to be viewed as a negative kind of guy….but I completely agree….this is NOT the JLA. It has none of what I consider to be the JLA. I’m always annoyed by writers who feel the need to jam in their favorite obscure characters to fill their own need to raise a character’s profile. Congorilla and Starman are so far and away NOT JLA it’s just depressing. If you REALLY wanted to throw me a curveball, put GRODD in the JLA…at least he is recognizable and cool. And I HATE the notion that the Titans have such low self esteem that they feel as though they have “graduated” into the JLA. The Titans are incredibly cool and are way more “family oriented” than the JLA is, so why are they so desperate to throw that away for a title. SLOPPY WRITING. Jade and Jesse Quick are JSA. This title is a debacle at best and shows what happens when DC gives up editorial control and allows writers with a lame premise to run off with their crown jewel. The next writer will now have to work overtime trying to create a team that will bring fans back on board…what a freaking mess.
I typically prefer the “Big 7″ but am currently enjoying the current book. I like seeing the next gen Titans characters getting a shot at the big time. If this same book were called Titans it would be promptly cancelled as I am sure the current villian run will soon be. Let’s give this a chance to breathe. Congorilla and Starman are really intersting characters.
I’ve always been a huge satellite era fan and I was actually enjoying this JLA series until Robinson took over. I think Meltzer and McDuffie both had the right mix of characters ranging from icons to lesser known heroes, but DC had to change the formula again and all of the characters I actually wanted to read about in JLA were dropped (Black Canary, Vixen, Zatanna, Hawkgirl, Dr. Light, Black Lightning, Red Arrow, etc.) I actually dropped the title a few months back along with JSA, which I also felt was suffering from bad storytelling- though at least the characters in that book still feel like the JSA.
Val
Who are the Justice League? They are Heroes and Heroines of the DC Universe that come together to make a difference and protect the world. Over the years there have been many members who have been part of the team. Maybe I’ve been spoiled by Justice League Unlimited where the roster is large and even JSA members are included, but I don’t think of the Justice League as just a small core group of iconic heroes.
I am a fan of the Justice League, Justice Society, Infinity Inc., Teen Titans, and the Green Lantern Corps. Over the years I come to like many of the DC Characters and watch them grow. The original Teen Titans and Infinity Inc. members are all grown up now and many have moved on into the JSA and JLA. I don’t have a problem with that, but you seem to label those heroes as part of their old or other teams. If they are currently serving as part of the JLA, then they are the JLA.
Sure DC has the old members busy. Bruce Wayne, Superman, Wonder Woman, Flash and Green Lantern are all tied up in their current story arcs. But I’m sure that they would feel at ease knowing that the heroes serving in their place in the JLA, Dick Grayson, Supergirl, Donna Troy, Jesse Chambers and Jade are capable of doing the job. They have worked with an mentored these heroes.
Now you may not want to read about these heroes, but they are some of my favorites. It’s their time to shine in the JLA. They are now the big guns, they are the Justice League of America.
Co-sign. It’s not so much about who is in the league, as much as it is about the quality of the story. Nostalgia rules in these hobbies, but it only takes you so far.
1. “They are Heroes and Heroines of the DC Universe that come together to make a difference and protect the world.” I respectfully disagree. That works for the Avengers. It has been their by line for years. But not the JLA. The JLA is the World’s Greatest Super-Heroes. I’ve enjoyed reading all those teams, plus the Legion and the Suicide Squad, but that does not mean a team of Alan Scott, Bart Allen, Brainiac 5.1, Jericho and Capt Boomerang is the JLA. It just does not “feel” right.
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2. “If they are currently serving as part of the JLA, then they are the JLA.” It was fine the Wally West was in the JLA when Barry was not available. But it made no sense to put Roy Harper in when Oliver Queen was available. The best of any ‘family’ or skill available belongs on the team.
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3. I have no issue with – and actually enjoy – the writer adding one or two heroes of their own choosing. The problem here is that they dumped the entire League and filled it with Titans, Inifinitors, and new characters. If they took a classic JLA team and added Congorilla and Starman, that would be great. But putting in substitutes for all 5 of the cornerstones of the DCU at the same time is crazy.
I stopped reading this book the moment they screwed Dwayne McDuffie.
The guy has written some of the best Justice League stories of our time. Can write the book in his sleep. And when all was said & done… DC Comics just wanted to string him along, long enough to secure a deal for Static and the rest of HIS Milestone Characters.
Just one more thing I hate about Dan Didio’s Agenda… Era… whatever you want to call it. Hell, I too don’t recognize the “current” JLA book as a legitimate League. And if I were to, I would still rank them a couple of notches lower than Justice League Extreme, Justice League Task Force, The Detroit League and Justice League Antartica!
Hell, at least the Detroit League had their share of Bonafide Memembers like Aquaman, J’onn, Zatanna and Batman. Plus they took on bad ass versions of Amazo, the Grey Martians, Despero and the Tornado Tyrant. All in all, not that bad. Their problem was that they lacked some of the more traditional Power Houses of the DC Universe.
This book has always been way more interesting when most of the Big 7 are NOT involved in any way. JLIis the archetype I prefer, a team full of people who are okay on their own but powerful together.
I am also a Big 7 guy and I have NO interest in reading these stories. I think I might buy it every month to have the whole run but I have yet to open the cover to read them. Maybe I should just save the money. I keep hopeing to see Wonder Woman but it’s a loss cause. They need to get the big guys back and make it the true Justice League!
I don’t think the JLA necessarily has to be the Big 7 but they do have to have some of the best heroes available.
The JLI might not have had the big 7 but a second look reveals that at the time, Dr. Fate, Blue Beetle, Captain Marvel, Batman, Booster Gold, Mr. Miracle, Captain Atom all had their own titles. Guy Gardner and Dr. Light had potential popularity fresh from Crisis. Both Beetle and Captain Marvel were flagship characters of the companies they were purchased from. (Charlton and Fawcett) Even the JLE had Wonder Woman, Captain Atom, Flash, Animal Man (all carrying titles on their own) to lead the way.
They DID have among the best heroes of that era.
But notice how the decline of that era began when they started just inserting anyone around in the early 90s. Although for a while, there was potential when Superman and Hal led JLA and JLE but that went south after a bit for the same reason.
DC is missing a major opportunity but I can see why it might not be immediately feasible. The most iconic versions of Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Martian Manhunter, Flash, Aquaman, Green Lantern and Green Arrow are all ACTIVE. (Batman Inc notwithstanding) Even the Atom, Hawkman, Hawkgirl and Firestorm (sort of) are back. Captain Atom and Booster Gold are both resurgent stars (although logically, Booster CAN’T be put in the JLA because of his new character angle) They could have even included a flagship hero from the Archie and Milestone books like The Shield and Icon.
Correct me if I’m wrong but the best Justice League book out there today is JL: Gen Lost.
And to SF’s point. I have indeed noticed that with the greatest crises of the DCU, the JL somehow finds itself disbanded or in shambles.With the exception of OWAW during which they were decimated as the first line of defense. Just once I’d like to see the League lead the DCU in a crisis.
I promise you, a JLA with Superman, Batman Bruce Wayne, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern Hal Jordan, Barry Allen Flash, Ollie Queen Green Arrow, The Atom, Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Martian Manhunter, Black Canary, Firestorm, Captain Atom, Captain Marvel, Hardware, Vixen, The Shield, Zatanna, perhaps with Geoff Johns as writer would be the NUMBER ONE SELLING BOOK.
So Erik, you’re NOT a fan of the Titans? Jade is the only member not having previously been on one incarnation of the Titans before, but was a founder of their Earth-2 counterpart, Infinity, Inc. Heck, I’ve been calling this grouping the “Justice Titans”, myself.
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Like you point out, the main reason we have this team is because all the “Big Guns” have been sidelined for one reason or another (walkabout, alternate reality, “dead” or just back, between Mega-Crossover Crises in their own titles) and the Titans title has been turned over to Deathstroke, Cheshire, and whatever Roy is going by these days now that he’s lost an arm and been shooting up again. (@_@)
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Of course, this isn’t the first time the team has been “full of second/third stringers” or non-”A list” heroes. You point out the Detroit League, mention JLI, and there’s also been the Diana-Wally team (Yazz years), among other periods where it’s been a “Non-team” book, which this run has suffered from almost consistently since it began a little over four years ago. (Justice Defenders??)
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I guess the point is, everyone has their own “vision” of what team is the greatest, from the original founders to the Satellite era, to Detroit, to the Year One Founders (Canary over WW), to JLI, to Doomsday/Breakdown era, to Morrison’s Big 7, to Vixen’s run up to today’s Justice Titans.
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There are always periods when a group title goes through lulls in popularity, moreso when the “main” characters have their own books that affect how they can be used in the team book. Electro-Supes and Hippolyta, anyone? Whatever era you like, it’s probably at least in part to the writer and how they handle the team they have assembled.
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Then again, Robinson referred to Donna’s SILVER lasso she carries sometimes as the “Blue Lasso of (Truthiness/Insipid Name Here)” or whatever it was. I wanted to strangle the frekking bastich right then and there. gggrrr……..!!!!
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I do agree with Anton that the title will be relaunched as soon as the main characters can be freed up from Geoff Johns’ clutches. Hopefully, the book won’t be given to one of his bestest buddies this time. or DiDio.
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(I’m not even going to bother with that JLA/99 mini. No clue who the 99 are, and it won’t be canon if I understand correctly that the 99 are from another COMPANY??)
Actually, I am a HUGE fan of the Titans, I just think these stories abotu these characters are being told in the wrong book. As I said, they have their own book, called Titans, which is also being currently misused.
And as I tried to say, I have no issue with Wally West, Kyle Rayner, or Dick Grayson as Flash, GL, and Batman, but now that Barry, hal, and Bruce are back, I expect to see them in the JLA.
Hal WAS back and briefly part of the team after that other Robinson book prior to this arc before the events in his Mega-Crossover Crisis pulled him out. Not sure why Jade is being used other than the other four GLC are involved in said MCC and her dad is busy in JSA. Who else was there to fill in the GL/lightbearer role? Ray? Argent?
Bruce *just* came back, so this past year only Dick has been available.
Ya got me on Jesse. not sure what her arc on Young All-Stars or whatever that book was or why she switched back from Liberty Belle II again or WHERE THE %&%&& WALLY HAS BEEN SINCE FLASH:REBIRTH?????
(other than burning that CBS costume with the DCAU logo?? ugh.)
I guess the F:R kept the other speedsters under wraps because Johns won’t let just anyone play with “his toys”?
Then again, McDuffie made do with the handful of characters he was allowed for his arc, with Vixen’s team. Too bad Robinson’s stuff isn’t up to par the last few years, with rookie mistakes and incomprehensible characterizations on everybody but “his toys”.
i have to agree with everyone else. this isn’t the JLA, it’s a 2nd string version of the big 7. now st walker is join to be another hal close. I don’t fault the writer completely though. Many of the past Leaguers are unavailable because
dead – vibe, steel, elongated man, blue beetle, mr miracle
JL gen lost-booter, capt atom, fire, ice, red rocket, power girl
brightest day – aquaman, jonn, firestorm, hawkman and girl
storylines in their books – superman, ww, bats, gl, flash, green arrow
but some characters are available and being ignored – atom, black canary, red tornado, zatana, vixen, gypsy, capt marvel (some version of him), Wally west Flash, dr light, john stewart
if you are going to do a 2nd string league i’d rather see a league with wally, capt marvel, bats and donna troy. add in zatanna,canary, tornado atom and john stewart.
story wise Vixen and Dr. Light didn’t want to be a part of the league after Blackest Night. Dinah is currently in Birds of Prey, and the story there kind of makes it hard for her to be in the league. Red Tornado was destroyed and was being rebuilt. Pretty much all the characters u’ve mentioned as being “ignored” are currently in books or actually have reasons in continuity why they aren’t a part of the league.
The argument that ‘story wise’ these characters are unavailable is not valid. Red Tornado has been rebuilt, in the back story of this comic. The current writer is the one who wrote out Vixen, Dr. Light, Plastic Man, Zatanna. They are all available, the writer just chooses not to use them.
superfriend pretty well summed it up. are these chars busy in other books.. yes. but if batman can be in 6 books and superman in 3 then black canary (who shares BoP with 4 other chars) can be in JLA. vixen, dr light, red tornado, plas were “written” out and aren’t appearing anywhere. Wally and Freddy Freeman are MIA.
Okay, except for a few of you who like the idea of an ever-changing league, YOU GUYS ARE TURNING INTO SQUARES, man. This is just like the whole “new Hollywood” vs the old guard in the 1960s. The world of comics, and JLA in this case, is just like that. Each generation has their interpretation, and it can be either loved or hated by the masses. Those who hate it do anything in their power to see “order” restored. Those who love it let the change continue, sometimes with limits, sometimes unabated. But for me, in my opinion, answering the problems each of you has expressed has only one solution-for a title like JLA, in the near future, I think it’s time DC took the ‘Unlimited’ approach, with a rotating cast of characters every issue or story arc. That way, you still have some of the ‘old guard’, but also get to see some new guys every now and then. Everyone wins.
I came back on board reading the Morrison/Porter JLA. I have not stopped yet. I find it interesting that the JLA or Justice League as it is now called has survived without the 7 core members. It is the JLA, to me whether is is Superman or Supergirl on the team and I am fine with Dick as Batman on the roster and as leader but they need to write him as the leader and to me, that is not really happening.
I certainly do love how passionate people get about this. I think this team has a ton of potential and I’m glad they’re in the Justice League. Yeah, sure, I like the Big Seven and all. Who doesn’t, but there are more than enough books to serve them right now. I like getting the chance to see characters interact who don’t usually get to. The big seven are always teaming up and crossing over. I think my only gripe with this book, and I’m sad to say this, is Mark Bagley. Let me just say that I think he’s an awesome artist and I’ve enjoyed him since Spider-man in the 90′s, but I don’t think this book suits him. I’m really excited to see Brett Booth’s take on this group. I think James has some good direction going and it’s nice to see someone finally on the book with some long term plans. Makes me want to stick around. I’m always excited for change though so lets see where this all takes us.
I rather like Bagley’s art. I’m a fan of any artist whose work looks more ‘animated’ as in animated cartoon, which is why he’s up on my list with Amanda Conner, George Perez, Ron Frenz/Sal Buscema, Jack Kirby, Dick Dillin, and John Romita, Sr. His take on the Thunderbolts, after they had just came out, made me think that the team deserved their own animated series. That’s what the art does for me.
I am all for people trying out new things. We all know that JLA will fall back onto its core safety net when the time is right, but for now let the people over at DC have some fun withou doing the same old.
Plus, there could be a kid out there right now picking up this comic and thinking it is the best. In thirty year HE will complain when they put X, Y & Z into the league instead of the team he likes. it is just a cycle.
Beyond the poor line-up, (which you’re all right to criticize) this book is just badly written. For me, that’s the deal breaker right there. I gave up on it a few months ago after suffering through about two years of awful stories. I’m not so loyal to DC that I’ll buy garbage. Time to cancel this book.
See, I really enjoy Robinson’s run on JLA and the team he’s put together. I am NOT a fan of the phrase and concept of “THE BIG SEVEN”. How boring! One of the cool things about Timm’s take on the League in JLU was that there were so many members. I like that idea used in the comic as well.
Also, this whole notion of “C Listers” or “A Listers” is really a problem for DC. They have to build characters. Think about it…when was the last time they pushed newer-then-30 year old characters?
Robinson brings in history of DC tidbits and great cameos. Plus he’s developing new, yes NEW DC characters. Developing Dr. Impossible, the whole “New Gang”, Omega Man. Good stuff.
Timm did have a ton of members in the JLU. Timm’s JLU consisted of the comic versions of the JLA, JLI, JSA, Seven Soldiers of Victory, and a few others as well. But it focused on the main team while featuring a few ‘guests’ in each story. Robinson has throw out the main team and put in the second string.
Just in case their is any misunderstanding, I have no issues, and enjoy it when new characters are ADDED to the main Justice League cast. My objection with this team is that the main team has been tossed out. The 5 featured in the Crime Syndicate arc have(had) their own book already, and their presence here is preventing stories of the real JLA from being told.
I can’t stand the concept of the Big 7. It was all well and good back in the 1960s, but the more people keep going back to the same well, the more the stories just feel like retreads. I’m a fan of actually moving forward, seeing new combinations and different line-ups for the team, characters who have never interacted before. I won’t deny some disappointment that the original line-up for Robinson’s team, complete with Hal Jordan, Ray Palmer, Dr. Light, Guardian, etc. , fell by the wayside just as soon as it began, but I’m enjoying watching Dick Grayson as Batman interact with Jesse Quick interact with Congorilla interact with Jade. It’s new, it’s different, it’s breaking new ground and it terrifies the same people who lost their minds when Kyle Rayner was the primary Green Lantern. They want comfort food, they want what they know, and they don’t want to be challenged. And catering to those people, and (even worse) putting people like that in charge of the company, only serves to hurt the industry overall.
DC is all about icons, which is great when you’re trying to sell mac and cheese or designer sneakers. But I don’t want to read about icons; I want to read about characters. Which is why most of the books I read at DC are of the low-selling variety…not by choice, but because I gravitate towards characters you CAN tweak and evolve without risking the corporation’s bottom line. I don’t want to read some stagnant story about a stagnant character who will inevitably revert back to the status quo within a year’s time. But those are the books that get ignored by fans in favor of the umpteenth Batman book or the ever-so-dramatic costume change of Wonder Woman or a new GL series focusing on a sentient French fry with a power ring. JLA will ultimately revert back to what the comfort food types want it to be, but in the interim I’m enjoying reading about a line-up I’ve never seen before. If I want the comfort food team, I’ll read the archives from the 60s and the 70s.
You know…where that line-up belongs.
That’s fine, except that most of this line-up needs to go back where it belongs, in the book named “Titans”.
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The reason Kyle and Wally worked was they WERE the icons as you put it. Its the same reason Roy did not work. I love these characters and have read every run of that title, I just feel their being in the JLA title prevents us from getting to read new adventures of the Worlds Greatest team.
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And yes, Congorilla is cool as a member of the JLA. I’d just like to read him interacting with Superman, Wonder Woman, Flash, and Green Lantern.
But WHY do they need to go back to a Titans title? These characters have been around for ten years (Jesse), twenty years (Jade), thirty years (Cyborg), forty years (Donna), sixty years (Dick). Just because some of them made their marks in the Teen Titans book, does that mean that they have to automatically be pigeonholed and relegated to that title? What does it take for a character to evolve and advance to where their appearances in new surroundings don’t immediately generate a knee-jerk reaction of “they don’t belong here”? Especially since that gimmick, being the young members of the DCU working together, has been taken over by the next generation of teens? Doesn’t it make sense for them to step up to the next level? You say Roy was a misfire, I thought he was a great addition until some power-that-be decided they liked Green Arrow again. So, flush all of that advancement down the tubes to maintain the Silver Age status quo.
Two things. One – DC had already ‘flushed’ Kyle, Wally, Conner Hawk, and Ryan Choi. One writer at DC felt Roy should be bumped up. The next did not. That has nothing to do with me.
Two – The problem is that the entire JLA was dumped to make room for this. Basically, the Titans team changed books and the JLA lost its book. If they did what Meltzer did and took the main JLA and added a few of the next generation, that would be fine. Its that they dumped the entire JLA to set this up.
This is why people make fun of comic book fans.