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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:28 pm 
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Aqua-expert to the rescue. Now this is based on what has come before. Johns may have thrown out/changed some or a lot of this. :?

stewbacca wrote:
Now the question is how much does the "sea Creature" thing work-- does that mean he gets Seals, Sea Lions, Walruses.. How about Sea Otters, Penguins, Pelicans or other Diving Aquatic Birds..

Yes. He's used aquatic birds many times in the past (back to the golden age, even)

I mean he gets crabs and such and some of those do stay on land, How about Saltwater Crocodiles, Water Moccassins, -- does it even go up the list to Polar Bears..

Crocs and Polar Bears, yes. Again back to the 40's. Sea snakes, yes. Other snakes, I don't think so.

And does his powers only apply to Underwater Animals, or is Saltwater a Requirement-- Can he talk to fresh Water Fish and animals as well.. Does the animal have to stay under water all the time-- because since he uses whales all the time-- clearly he can control Mammals as well..

Both types. Fresh or salt. He has mentioned on a few occasions that fresh water creatures are more difficult for him. In the 80's he exhibited the ability to affect humans somewhat, because we share part of our brains with fish. Never quite bought that myself.

And does he actually control them-- or is he like Dr. Doolittle and the animals respond to him because he can speak to them.. Are they willing to sacrifice their life for him just because he talks to them-- or because they cant control themselves..

This has been all over the map. At first, they volunteered willingly. Later because it was their duty to serve their king. During PAD's run, AQ would cajole them to assist (and they had personalities like sharks were REALLY dumb and dolphins were REALLY smart), but bring the Telepathic smackdown command if he had to.

And to me- these are some important Aquaman questions to be answered..


I'm also interested in how John's is gonna handle this particular power.

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:29 pm 
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Also, according to Jim Kreuger & Alex Ross, he can regenerate parts of his body like swamp thing & deadpool, specifically his brain which was partially removed by brainiac.


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:21 am 
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Correct, but that was an Elseworld's situation.

Of course, everything that came before is now an Elseworlds, I guess. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:30 pm 
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as far as i'm concerned, as soon as a character's creator hands over the reins to another writer, the character is merely a character, and though there may be constants in said character's bio or origin (i.e., superman will almost assuredly always be from krypton, iron man will always be tony stark [formerly drunken] billionaire industrialist, batman will always be avenging the murder of his parents -although neither the super friends nor adam west's batmans never really gave me that impression - the incredible hulk will always have been a scientist, spiderman will have always been bitten by a radioactive spider, etc), whatever direction the new writer takes the character is entirely his or her perrogative and the merit of the storyline is then decided solely BY ME, ANYWAY on the writer's ability.

I'll use Swamp Thing as an example. Wein & Wrightson created Swamp Thing. They built a mythos around Swamp Thing. Then they handed over writing to some other guy who I cant remember and a few issues later, Swamp Thing was cancelled. Then Swamp Thing gets revived because they made a crappy movie about it. I don't consider anything about the Swamp Thing movie other than Adrienne Barbeau's tinklebobs to be worth anything at all, so to me, none of that is part of Swamp Thing (except that Constantine mentions at some point later that the thing he's looking for isnt that crazy swamp thing they made a movie about). The first 19 issues of the 2nd run of Swamp Thing were allright. A little dreary and long and meandering, but I enjoyed them (if for no reason other than the Phantom Stranger back-up features that have yet to be collected into a trade, unfortunately). Then Alan Moore took over and wrote an amazing mythos that departed considerably from Wein & Wrightson. Was it wrong to do that? That's your opinion. It is mine that not only was it not wrong, it was very right. As much as I love W&W Swampy, Moore's run on Swamp Thing is Swamp Thing to me. After that, I never really got into much of anything anyone else wrote about him. My Swamp Thing doesnt have a daughter conceived by the possessed semen of John Constantine. He also doesnt whatever the hell has been happening to him until Brightest Day. Now he's back, and what I've read so far, I've really liked. Does it negate Alan Moore's Swamp Thing or even Wein & Wrightson's? Not to me. Nothing does. Whoever Swamp Thing has always been to me is who he always will be. But that doesnt mean I'm not willing to read someone else who knows what they're doing write a story around him, and if Snyder writes him well, whatever he chooses to do with Swamp Thing will become part of my Swamp Thing too.

It doesnt matter whether or not they say Barbara Gordon was shot and paralysed by the Joker, because to every single one of us, she was. That's just always going to be part of who our Barbara Gordon is. If you don't like what happens to her now, then pleeple on whoever's writing her. Superman had a mullet at one point. cant make that go away. But it doesnt affect who the character is, even though those stories were "in cannon". Now he's got a dumb ass costume. One of many versions, one of many stories featuring a character every single one of us knows like thier best friend in our hearts.


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:45 pm 
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Slow clap for shishalzafrazz. I really really agree with you, but I think the (vast?) majority of comic fans don't think that way, or at least the majority of DC fans aren't thinking that way with respect to the new stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 10:29 pm 
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word, well, like i said, i'm pretty much new to the picking-up-full-runs-of-comics-from-the-get-go game. maybe in 10 years after we're on Swamp Thing issue 120 and somebody gives him 3 breasts that lactate maple syrup all the time, I'll start freaking out, but probably, I'll just stop reading it.

i have personal, albeit slightly skewed possibly, versions of these characters in my head, and "history" of dc doesnt really affect them to me. i've read crisis on infinite earths, infinite crisis, and final crisis, and none of them grabbed enough of anything in me to incorporate it into my personal dc history. i'm pretty old school 70's anyhow. as far as i'm concerned, the sinestro corps doesnt ACTUALLY exist and ESPECIALLY niether does any of the other crazy ass lantern gangs. star sapphire is carol ferris. sinestro wears a blue and black evil-kermit-the-frog-looking costume. that's all the people who have rings to me. i acknowledge the existance of john stewart and jade and guy gardner and ONLY BECAUSE OF MORRISONS JLA RUN even kyle 90's rayner (god what a silly 90's-ass name! might as well have named him kane tyler or dante styles or some crap. seriously. awful. makes me think of matchbox 20 and creed.). Invincible? As long as Kirkman still writes him, he's only what Kirkman has said he is so far. Plastic Man, on the other hand, after Goodwin took over writing after Jack Cole, has become many things. Some of them are textbook Plas, and being stupid slapstick comic relief isnt one of them TO ME.

Anyhow, my point is, bringing this back to Aquaman, who Aquaman is to me is and what powers he has are the things that I like that Aquaman has been and done since his original creator turned his character loose. And regeneration as written by Ross & Kreuger is one of those powers. I know Justice is one of those Elseworlds titles, but that Aquaman really spoke to me as a superhero, like this new incarnation, and so that's part of my Aquaman.


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 10:33 pm 
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also, i'm not sure how it happened cause i never read it, but didnt he grow his hand back? i mean, he had that hook and then that silly water hand and now he's got 2 gloves full of fingers. also, wasnt the hook only to give him more of an appearance of being a scurvy sea dog? how did he even lose it?


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 6:47 am 
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He lost his hand in the first few issues of the Peter David run. A new villain made Piranha eat it off. (?!? :? ?!?)

The hook was originally just a hook and then later was converted by STAR labs into something a bit more versatile and adaptable.

Later, he was something along the lines of Mythical Arthur and met "the lady in the lake" and was made into her Water Bearer complete with magic water hand.

During Final Night and his death and then in Brightest Day when he was resurrected he came back with both his hands intact.

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:47 am 
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Beat me to it. :mrgreen:

The problem is, except for that ONE story, he's never exhibited regeneration. Even PAD poked fun at the idea early in his run. Vulko was telling Garth how some of the commoners were expecting the king's hand to grow back, and Aqualad responded along the lines of "Why? He's Aquaman, not Starfish man."

:lol:

Obviously, anybody can have any view of their fictional heroes they want. In my view (and probably most comic book readers as you've stated), one mini-series doesn't trump decades of lore.

If he has regeneration in the new 52, well, I can't really call foul, 'cause it's a new universe and all. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 10:28 am 
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bnjmnrlyr wrote:
He lost his hand in the first few issues of the Peter David run. A new villain made Piranha eat it off. (?!? :? ?!?)


thats kinda what i meant. in empire strikes back, luke gets his hand cut off by vader because vader is looking to cripple him without killing him, i guess. even though making a bionic hand for him was a scene in the movie, it was clearly not so luke would not have a hand as part of his character in return of the jedi. i wonder if, when they sat down to write aquaman, they were like, how can we make him have a hook hand? ooh! i know! what if a new enemy has piranha powers!? then the piranha can eat off just one of his hands and he can have a hook replace it! arrr!

kinda surprised buster bluth didnt read aquaman comics in arrested development. that would have TOTALLY fit in with his character.

also, i always have to go back and re-read piranha when i type it. it's one of those words with an oddly placed "h", like diarrhea.

also, thanks for saving me the trouble of taking 30 seconds to look that up on wikipedia, ben, and shell, i know you would've if he hadnt beat you to it, so thanks to you also.


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 11:00 am 
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Thanks Shellhead--

Explains some things to me-- So I guess that means hippos as well--

It just seems odd that you could strand him in the heart of Africa and he'd be able to pass himself off as Tarzan--

And since you are the expert..


Has Aquaman ever used the Loch Ness Monster? Or saved Homer Simpson (when Maggie wasnt available? :mrgreen: )

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 10:41 am 
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Not that I know of, although he's used "sea serpents" on more than one occasion in the silver age, which are basically plesiosaurs. :mrgreen:

In the "modern" era, I don't think he can control marine dinosaurs. At least he couldn't during his brief 14 issue series in the mid-80's ('cause he fought one).

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:03 pm 
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hey, did the giffen/fleming special come out before or after the 4 issue mini? also, are those 5 issues any good? giffen and fleming are pretty hit or miss.


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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:08 am 
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Issue two was bloody good fun, albeit too short. Is 20 pages the new norm now? :?

Spoiler: show
The Trench are pretty gory and a bit disgusting with that spittle thing they do. I'm wondering who's actually behind them? Johns has mentioned that he's planning on rehabilitating another Aqua-villain into a major player (a la Blackhand a few years ago) in the near future, so I'm wondering if these creatures are just catspaws. Aquaman's rogue's gallery isn't all that great after Ocean Master and Black Manta, so Johns doesn't have much to choose from. Of the second tier, the best candidates in my opinion are either the Fisherman or the Scavenger. I just can't imagine even Johns could make the Flying Fish cool. Of course my knowledge of Silver Age Aquaman is a bit foggy so their could be someone else out there that I'm forgetting. :lol:


The art is awesome, regardless. Here's hoping Ivan stays on the book for a long time.

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 Post subject: Re: The Aquaman Thread
PostPosted: Sat Oct 29, 2011 11:55 am 
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Loved the second issue too. Mera is a beast! I'm glad she's working with Aquaman.


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